Return of the Gnome

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Wolf
Posts: 6
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2019 11:10 am

Wed Feb 13, 2019 11:53 am

I see that gnomes are officially back in WFRP 4 and as a playable PC race, according to Graeme Davis’s summary of the contents of Rough Nights and Hard Days.

Given their inclusion appears to have been surprisingly controversial at times and the fact they haven’t been referred to as existing in the Warhammer universe for so long, it seems an unexpected but welcome, for those who recall 1st edition, move.
Knight of the Lady
Posts: 59
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2019 11:04 am

Wed Feb 13, 2019 12:32 pm

Personally I'm not an old timer so I can't say that gnomes or no gnomes really concern me. I've never played 1st edition so I don't really feel that I have a relation with the gnomes in Warhammer to either like or dislike them. In fact I don't even know what they are about in the first place!
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Hyarion
Posts: 46
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2019 11:56 am

Wed Feb 13, 2019 12:58 pm

I like the nod to feel a bit more inclusive of 1e (although I will continue to hold out for a non-trivial section of the 4e Realms of Sorcery dealing with the Gods of Law) and as long as C7 can make Gnomes fill a niche that currently isn't filled, then I for one welcome our new Gnomish overlords.

The two things I don't want to happen are that A) Gnomes become WFRP-Kender or B) Gnomes are merely "halflings with shoes" ie virtually identical to Dwarves or Halflings with some minor twist.
I hold the glaive of Law against the Earth.
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Orin J.
Posts: 81
Joined: Wed Feb 06, 2019 10:39 pm

Wed Feb 13, 2019 9:07 pm

I feel like there's more to lose than gain from this, the gnomes had exactly two real traits to them in 1st: they were illusionists and they were very close to dying out. we've lost the first one effectively (unless they somehow slide a new school of magic in there for them, the whole point was it didn't really have any way to directly attack) and the second one is a little darker than C7 has seemed willing to go. on top of that, they have nowhere they really fit comfortably purpose-wise in regards to the setting.

a slapdash addition is just going to fall flat, and with the state the rulebook is in they need to make some good impressions on new players fast.
Graak
Posts: 25
Joined: Mon Jan 14, 2019 11:50 pm

Wed Feb 13, 2019 11:40 pm

I am also very negative about this addition. When I started playing wfrp in 2005 I wanted a fantasy game that was grimdark and as far as possible from D&D. In fact I didn't introduce halflings until years later. I didn't need any homage to Tolkien nor D&D and until I got that halflings in wfrp had that criminal/mobsters bent I really couldn't feel they have a place in the Old World.

Regarding gnomes there's literally no trope about them that I like so far.
Bitsa
Posts: 18
Joined: Thu Jan 17, 2019 5:53 am

Thu Feb 14, 2019 3:33 am

Graak wrote:
Wed Feb 13, 2019 11:40 pm
I am also very negative about this addition. When I started playing wfrp in 2005 I wanted a fantasy game that was grimdark and as far as possible from D&D. In fact I didn't introduce halflings until years later. I didn't need any homage to Tolkien nor D&D and until I got that halflings in wfrp had that criminal/mobsters bent I really couldn't feel they have a place in the Old World.

Regarding gnomes there's literally no trope about them that I like so far.
Well in wfrp1 gnomes were hard-bitten arseholes, basically. (I haven't played 1e, just read it)

I haven't had gnomes in any warhammer stuff before either, but after reading about them in 1e they don't seem so bad.

I like gnomes in their earlier Discworld novels...
Whymme
Posts: 18
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2019 12:18 pm

Thu Feb 14, 2019 4:05 am

Gnomes were a bit of an afterthought in WFRP1, just a joke article to fill the pages of a WD magazine. Somehow, from there they achieved a sort of iconic status, partly thanks to the figure of Alphonse Hercule de Gascogne in the excellent scenario "With a little help from my friends", but mostly because they were struck in WFRP2, along with Fimir, and so became a sort of rallying cry, a symbol of all the bad things that the new edition has brought.

As for the setting, gnomes do very little, as do halflings. Elves and dwarfs are politically interesting and bring some weight in a scenario thanks to the elaborate background story of the races, the other non-human races a lot less so. They just carry the disadvantages of non-human races in any setting; that of immediately being a stereotype.

Why is this thread in the tavern, by the way, and not in the WFRP4 forums? This thread is about the inclusion of the pointy hatted, larcenous mini-dwarfs in WFRP4, isn't it?
satakuua
Posts: 49
Joined: Fri Apr 05, 2019 11:59 am
Location: Helsinki

Thu Apr 11, 2019 12:56 am

Whymme wrote:
Thu Feb 14, 2019 4:05 am
Gnomes were a bit of an afterthought in WFRP1, just a joke article to fill the pages of a WD magazine. Somehow, from there they achieved a sort of iconic status, partly thanks to the figure of Alphonse Hercule de Gascogne in the excellent scenario "With a little help from my friends", but mostly because they were struck in WFRP2, along with Fimir, and so became a sort of rallying cry, a symbol of all the bad things that the new edition has brought.

As for the setting, gnomes do very little, as do halflings. Elves and dwarfs are politically interesting and bring some weight in a scenario thanks to the elaborate background story of the races, the other non-human races a lot less so. They just carry the disadvantages of non-human races in any setting; that of immediately being a stereotype.

Why is this thread in the tavern, by the way, and not in the WFRP4 forums? This thread is about the inclusion of the pointy hatted, larcenous mini-dwarfs in WFRP4, isn't it?
"With a little help" is superb. One of the scenarios I really like running. Always best when the players start planning like pros.

And I did not remember gnomes were dying. It does add to it all. I do like that, even though there never seemed to be much space for the race.
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Grim Dork
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Tue May 14, 2019 4:00 pm

In my head, for some reason, there isn't a big enough difference between Halflings and Gnomes. I mean the logical side of me knows that there is. But I just can't separate the two enough for me to care about them being in my campaign.
I've been called a grim bastard once or twice in my life.

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